Tremendous result for Oranje vs Germany!

November 15th, 2011 | by: Jan |

hunter duits
Holy Bratwursten Batman, the Zjermans are bitchslappin’ us

We fooled them yet again!

Back in 1986, we played Germany ( West-Germany to be precise) in a friendly and we missed a couple of regulars ( Van Basten and Rijkaard weren’t there) while Arnold Muhren and Erwin Koeman weren’t selected yet. The Germans won – scoring thrice- and felt tremendous.

The taunts were debilitating and endured it with a smile. Our national team manager made some changes and used this game to prep the lads for when it really counted…. Two years later, we beat them in the semis and won the title on their home soil. Ouch, that hurt!

And now we did the same thing. We allowed Germany to think they were better.

And in less than a year ( with our big guns back and most likely another back four ) we will show them what Total Football is about.

Because seriously, they played counter football yet again, didn’t they?

And yes, they are good like that. But hey, we could beat Oranje if they decide not to mark. And not to backtrack. And to spill the ball and not respond.

bert duits

It was dreadful. But it’s a good thing.

If Holland would have beaten Germany 0-3, I would fear for our chances. Babel, Sneijder even Kuyt would be walking around chest out with a “who can beat us” smirk.

Now, all the big egos know their place. And that is:

(in the words of Johan Cruyff)

“If Holland doesn’t play with 100% concentration and focus they are a pretty mediocre team with a couple of excellent players….”

muller duits
“I’m sure they started with a backfour, but I can’t find them now….”

But, apart from the focus and concentration ( and the fact that some of our top dogs weren’t available) we do need to focus on what is swiftly becoming a major problem.

Because, sure…a number of creative forwards weren’t here ( so I can live with our “0″). But all of our defenders and holding midfielder were there ( bar Pieters) so I can’t understand that “3″)!!!!

What.Where.They.Thinking?

Let’s not pressure the ball?
Let’s not man mark Klose, Muller and Ozil?
Let’s not anticipate?
Let’s not backtrack?

So, it’s time (now!!) to act! To analyse our back four and two holding mids.

Does Mathijsen still have it? Or is it time for Douglas to step in. Or maybe indeed Van Bommel?

As we have a plethoria of holding mids ( De Jong, Strootman, Schaars, Fer) why can’t we use Van Bommel or even Strootman ( length) as libero?

I’ve said it before: most opponents play with 2 strikers max, so we only need 3 defenders.

bassie gulli
This pic was taken 6.5 hours after the game. Bassie and Gulli are slowly recovering from their shock

We need a better option on the left flank if Pieters is out. I’m sorry. Braafheid was the invisible man. Where are our defenders??

Van der Wiel is ok, but who do we have behind him? Really? Boulah?

It’s starting to hurt.

Heitinga is not that bad but I wouldn’t mind finding better options.

We need a killer at the back. A Douglas. A Stam. A Van Tiggelen.

And we need a player in the center who can build up. A Strootman. A Van Bommel.

Furthermore, we need to play with players on the wing that have depth and speed.

Kuyt is brilliant when we have movement coming centrally. But as Sneijder is static in midfield and Huntelaar is a poacher in the box, we need speed and skill on the flanks. Not a holding winger ( my term…copyrighted). That’s what Kuyt is ( and I love Kuyt, don’t get me wrong), but he is a holding winger. Like Rafael on the left was. No speed.

bert low suits
“Hey! Nose picker! First you copy our style of playing and now you also copy my style of clothing? Really?? Even the scarf? How can you sink so Low?”

Someone save Elia.

Someone heal Robben.

Babel has speed but lacks the skill to play the “Dutch” game. That’s why he’s good in the Bundesliga.

I’m happy with this result.

Bert van Marwijk has a notebook full of notes. To work on. In the coming months.

And practice. And talk. And listen. And learn.

Marco van Basten and Ruud Gullit analysed the team for Dutch tv and they were in shock.

Van Basten: “For a moment there, I felt like Oranje has had it’s peak already and is on the way out….”

Gullit: “You can’t win games if you allow so much space and defend so lacklustre. This is a serious issue. I saw it creeping into the team already some games back. It’s time to get into action.”

Some people will say that this Oranje is too safe for players who don’t play well. Mathijsen? Van Bommel? Braafheid? Kuyt? Maybe it’s time that Bert leaves them home for a while.

Let’s hope the Germans get drunk and think they’re the top. And let’s hope Oranje is ashamed and starts to look where they improve.

joris duits
Joris took a day off

The 1986 game…. Koeman, Gullit, Schip, Van Breukelen, Blind, Vanenburg, Boeve to name a few… And even Robbie de Wit!

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Comments

Displaying the most recent 25 comments from a total of 111 comments.

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By Mano | November 17th, 2011 at 2:28 pm

let’s be honest with ourselves….. we lost to germany fair and square. no matter how you cut the cake, we fell asleep on the wheel 3 times and the germans beat us to the punch.

you all give way too much credit to the missing ’stars’ … robben is aging and injury-prone, VdV has never been a true starter (but certainly a defensive liability), pieters is only now establishing himself, and and afellay always started on the bench… of the missing members only persie could have provided some attacking verve up front but let us not forget his meager contribution to our WC2010 dreams.

as most of you feel, i do think we are one of the top contenders for euro2012 but we need to start executing. we cannot just rely on sneijder. we need to implement some youngsters into our system quickly so they are ready for brazil (ricky wolf, douglas, wijnaldum, strootman, luuk & siem brothers).

the future is bright but we need to act quickly.

on another note, how many of you agree that if Bert (his father-in-law) wasn’t coach, Bommel wouldn’t get so much playing time, he is too old!! he is a great player don’t get me wrong but we need a replacement !

By goose | November 17th, 2011 at 2:45 pm

im still a bit hurt .. for me the Germany game is not just any game; and it was a friendly only in name..

apart from a game or 2 during qualifications i havent seen us play a decent 90 min, including the WC

btw; cant believe how Cruijff is being back-stabbed!!! esp, by that asshole Davids,, Jan, assume you have a piece on this coming up?

Posted from Netherlands

By Jamie | November 17th, 2011 at 2:57 pm

@Mano, I think MVB would be getting his time regardless of the coach, if not just for his leaderships qualities. I think at this stage Kuyt wouldn’t be getting any playing time with any other coach. I also don’t think you give enough credit to the missing stars. VDV is the best player on a team that is fighting for a top 4 in the toughest league in the world. Affelay was deemed good enough for even Barca, and your words about Robben: yes, he is certainly injury prone, but no, I don’t think at 27 I’d consider him aging just yet, and I believe when he is healthy he is easily one of the top 5 attacking players in the world. And there need not be anything said about RVP that hasn’t already been said. When healthy, I believe we boast the best attacking players in the world 7-11.

By Ilir | November 17th, 2011 at 3:24 pm

I read a lot about VDV as one of the big absentees. With Sneijder in the team he has to play as a winger. When Redknap tried him there with Tottenham he complained that he doesn’t have the stamina to run back and forth, hence he’s a liability (remember WC final?). At least he’s not a 90 minutes footballer. You can’t play total football with players that can’t run.
Some say here it was just a friendly and we missed key players etc. I thought there isn’t such a thing as friendly against Germany. What’s disturbing is that there was no desire and no grit. It was a total apathy. At times it seemed like Germans were playing with 14 players. It reminded me of the game against Russia, EC 2008. At least in that game Van Der Sar, Ruud the Man and Sneijder gave everything they had, but against Germany nobody showed up.

By Ilir | November 17th, 2011 at 4:01 pm

I found this website with all the 1978 games.
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~goldkeep/Holland78/

By Tiju | November 17th, 2011 at 4:38 pm

With in a short time sami khedira sealed his place in german team by replacing ballack what else we want….
Adam maher is 1000 times better than kuyt….
Anas achabar is 1000 times better than babel and elia
Van annholt is 1000 times better than brapheid.
Deguzman is far better than current bommel.
Douglas is above joris in any aspect
Ricky wolfswinkel in 1000 tomes better than luuk de jong.and slighlty better than hunter too.
only issue is that they are not playing for a big team and they have not proved it infront some BLIND PEOPLES.

By Tiju | November 17th, 2011 at 4:41 pm

WHAT MESSI PROVED AT BARCA AT THE AGE OF 14????????TO BE IN FIRST TEAM??????????REAL TALENTS DOESNT NEED MUCH EXPERIENCE…Adam maher and Anas acchabr has brainthey are the next vaart and zneijder….Not headless drenthe,elia or babel.

By Ronald | November 17th, 2011 at 5:13 pm

@ Jad:
Just to get the balance. You named the Elftal reats that were missing. Fair enough.

You said: If Germany played without Schweinsteiger (btw: gotta get this spelling right, because he is an up-and-coming super star – listed in FIFA’s array of candidates for ‘11, next to Özil and Müller): well, in fact he d i d miss the Holland match ! And also missing were Lahm and Schürrle (hard to spell but the world will learn), and Goetze got only a few minutes.

So the missing Germans outweighed the missing Dutch in terms of quality.

So instead of depreciating the Germany side you ought to worry about Dutch defiviencies – which were apparent as early as SA 2010 and have been acerbated meanwhile.

And you know it.

Bottom line: Germany abound in super talents, Holland are gradually runnung out of talents.

By Ronald | November 17th, 2011 at 5:15 pm

Correction:
line 1 should read “the Elftal greats that were missing”

By Michel-Olivier | November 17th, 2011 at 5:20 pm

loew could of field 2 different team and they would of still beat orange. age wise the german team is much younger compare to orange and after euro12 they do not have to built a new team for wc14.

klose(33)
podolski(26)-ozil(23)-muller(22)
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Posted from United States

By Jan | November 17th, 2011 at 5:37 pm

Hey Goose, yes a piece on JC-Louis-Ajax is coming up .

What a Shakespearean drama that is, eh?

I can answer what is wrong with Elia. He is a difficult guy. Because he’s a street bloke, without any discipline or social skills and I believe he is “uneducated” is the pc word.

Trust me. This kid has sensational skills but they will only “work” if he’s used by a coach who understands and tolerates him and handles him the right way. He failed at Ajax, was picked up at Den Haag and treated well at Twente but at Hamburg he only excelled under a specific treatment.

Now, at Juve which is a football factory like Chelsea, Man City, Real Madrid, Inter it’s obvious he fails.

Sad but true…

By goose | November 17th, 2011 at 5:59 pm

@Ronald; agree with you 100%

@Jan; yeah, unbelievable how they have treaded the 1 true icon in dutch football (maybe even the 1 true icon in dutch sports) .. ecp. that Davids, overrated little basterd
without Cruijff Ajax would have been nothing, Michels would be nothing etc.

Posted from Netherlands

By Miguel Rosado | November 17th, 2011 at 6:13 pm

Spain has lost so many games after the WC!!!.

Bert has enough time to make things right this was a wake up call.

By Miguel Rosado | November 17th, 2011 at 6:17 pm

what has Bert said about the defeat???

By hien | November 17th, 2011 at 7:01 pm

After 3 bad games in a row, perhaps it is time for Bert to call up new players and have a backup plan when Sneijder, Robben, Van Persie, Elia, Afellay are not available?

Posted from United States

By Oranje | November 17th, 2011 at 9:48 pm

Lame ass!!! LOL!!!

Posted from Malaysia

By Shanan | November 17th, 2011 at 11:02 pm

@ michel olivier, 2 brilliant orange teams (each BETTER than both german sides…. and a solid bench):

————–Stekelenburg————-
—Wiel—Heitinga—Douglas—Pieters—
————-Bommel—Strootman———
——Persie—-Sneijder—-Robben——-
—————–Huntelaar—————

——————–Krul—————-
—Van Aanholt—Bruma—Bhoula—Maduro—
————-De Jong (Nigel)—De Jong (Luuk)—
———Kuyt—-VdV—-Afellay——-
—————–Wolfswinkel—————

BENCH
12. Vorm
13. Cillessen
DEFENSE
14. Anita
15. Mathijsen
16. Blind or Kuiper
MIDFIELD
17. Urby
18. Drenthe
19. Siem
20. Schaars
FORWARDS
21. Wijnaldum
22. Jon Guzman or Lens
23. Elia

By OranjeAussie | November 18th, 2011 at 2:41 am

@Miguel Rosado…. love your lineup but i dont know about Elia. i would be more inclined to take Kuyt what he lacks he makes up in his versatility and his passion for the Oranje shirt.

By Maarten | November 18th, 2011 at 9:05 am

Luuk de Jong as DM? He’s a real striker, so I doubt he’ll perform in that position. His brother isn’t Oranje quality.
Daley Blind couldn’t even cope with the winger of NAC so he’s no real subsistution for the defence.
Bhoula doesn’t have the quality to wing, but would like to see him as CB though.

Up for Oranje IMO:

Krul (should be goalie, I have seen Steekie nailed to the ground too many times. )
van Aanholt
van Dijk (FC Gron.)
Fer
Clasie (only when he’s on fire )
Castaignos
van Wolfswinkel
Beerens
Maher
Ola John
Landzaat (can be decisive in a game)
Boerigter

I don’t know yet but Jetro Willems showed a good game at his debut, haven’t really followed him yet.

Posted from Netherlands

By Demi | November 18th, 2011 at 7:27 pm

The Germans have always been like that. When they see softness they beat the opponent to pulp. Be it the Arab emirates or the Oranje in a bad day, that’s how the Germans build their name. By killing the week

Has always been like that, will always be. Its their style and mentality.

Recent example? WC2010. They found Argentina with more holes than Swiss cheese and they beat it to pulp. And with Spain ? Possession 30%-%70 LOL man , no real chance of winning…

That’s the way it is, has always been. Impress the ones who easily fall for the blitzkrieg on the weak.
.

Having said that , it’s clear since BvM benched DeJong the 4-2-3-1 doesn’t work well …

Time to bring Nigel back 100% and perhaps move MvB to the defense.

Posted from United States

By equalizer | November 19th, 2011 at 12:21 pm

For me taking into account SKILLS, EXPERIENCE, AGE and POTENTIAL, these are the TOP 23 Dutch players.

Oranje’s best 23 (traditional 4-3-3):

———–1.Stekelenburg———-

——–4.Heitinga-5.Douglas——-
2.V.d.Wiel—————-3.Pieters

————-6.V.Bommel————
——8.Afellay—-10.Sneijder—–

11.Robben—-9.V.Persie——7.Elia

GOAL
12. Krul (Newcastle – GK)
13. Vorm (Swansea – GK)
DEFENCE
14. Mathijsen (Malaga – D,C)
15. Boulahrouz (Stuttgart – D,RC)
16. Maduro (Valencia – D/DM,C)
17. Emanuelson (AC Milan – D/M,L)
MIDFIELD
18. N.De Jong (Man City – DM,C)
19. V.d.Vaart (Tottenham – M/AM,C)
20. De Guzman (Villarreal – AM,RC)
FORWARDS
21. Wijnaldum (PSV – AM/F,RC)
22. Huntelaar (Schalke – S,C)
23. Boerrigter (Ajax – F,L)

2nd XI

—————-12.Krul——————

———15.Maduro-16.Mathijsen———-
14.Boulahrouz————–17.Emanuelson-

————–18.N.De Jong—————
——–20.Maher—-19.V.d.Vaart——-

21.Wijnaldum–22.Huntelaar–23.Boerrigter

Holland EURO 2012 Full Squad (23)

GOAL
1. Stekelenburg (Roma – GK)
12. Krul (Newcastle – GK)
13. Vorm (Swansea – GK)
DEFENCE
2. V.d.Wiel (Ajax – D,RC)
3. Pieters (PSV – D,L)
4. Heitinga (Everton – D/DM,C)
5. Douglas (Twente – D,C)
14. Boulahrouz (Stuttgart – D,RC)
15. Maduro (Valencia – D/DM,C)
16. Mathijsen (Malaga – D,C)
17. Emanuelson (Milan – D/M,L)
MIDFIELD
6. V.Bommel (Milan – DM,C)
8. Afellay (Barcelona – M/AM,RLC)
10. Sneijder (Inter – AM,C)
18. N.De Jong (Man City – DM,C)
19. V.d.Vaart (Tottenham – M/AM,C)
20. De Guzman (Villarreal – AM,RC)
FORWARDS
7. Elia (Juventus – F,RL)
9. V.Persie (Arsenal – F,RLC)
11. Robben (Bayern – F,RL)
21. Wijnaldum (PSV – AM/F,RC)
22. Huntelaar (Schalke – S,C)
23. Boerrigter (Ajax – F,RL)

By equalizer | November 19th, 2011 at 12:41 pm

For me taking into account SKILLS, EXPERIENCE, AGE and POTENTIAL, these are the TOP 23 Dutch players.

Oranje’s best 23 (traditional 4-3-3):

———-1.Stekelenburg———

——-4.Heitinga-5.Douglas——
2.V.d.Wiel————–3.Pieters

————6.V.Bommel———–
—–8.Afellay—-10.Sneijder—-

11.Robben—9.V.Persie—7.Elia–

GOAL
12. Krul (Newcastle – GK)
13. Vorm (Swansea – GK)
DEFENCE
14. Boulahrouz (Stuttgart – D,RC)
15. Maduro (Valencia – D/DM,C)
16. Mathijsen (Malaga – D,C)
17. Emanuelson (AC Milan – D/M,L)
MIDFIELD
18. N.De Jong (Man City – DM,C)
19. V.d.Vaart (Tottenham – M/AM,C)
20. De Guzman (Villarreal – AM,RC)
FORWARDS
21. Wijnaldum (PSV – AM/F,RC)
22. Huntelaar (Schalke – S,C)
23. Boerrigter (Ajax – F,L)

2nd XI

——————12.Krul——————-

———–15.Maduro-16.Mathijsen———–
14.Boulahrouz——————17.Emanuelson

—————-18.N.De Jong—————-
——–20.De Guzman—-19.V.d.Vaart——–

21.Wijnaldum—22.Huntelaar—23.Boerrigter-

Holland EURO 2012 Full Squad (23)

* edit, squad numbering error corrected.

By mooinl | November 19th, 2011 at 4:24 pm

equalizer thats an almost perfect line-up imo. i especially like the backup defenders, in particular their flexibility to also play in midfield. only thing i’d change is bring Lens in as a forward, swapping Wijnaldum for De Guzman as a backup mid playmaker, reason being just in case either RVP or KJH got injured we’d still have a guy in reserve who can still play as central striker, but also is fast, tricky and flexible. so for me this is the absolute perfect squad:

Oranje’s best 23 (traditional 4-3-3):

————–1.Stekelenburg———

———4.Heitinga-5.Douglas——
2.V.d.Wiel————–—-3.Pieters

——————6.V.Bommel———–
—–-8.Afellay—-10.Sneijder—-

11.Robben—9.V.Persie—7.Elia–

GOAL
12. Krul (Newcastle – GK)
13. Vorm (Swansea – GK)
DEFENCE
14. Boulahrouz (Stuttgart – D,RC)
15. Maduro (Valencia – D/DM,C)
16. Mathijsen (Malaga – D,C)
17. Emanuelson (AC Milan – D/M,L)
MIDFIELD
18. N.De Jong (Man City – DM,C)
19. V.d.Vaart (Tottenham – M/AM,C)
20. Wijnaldum (PSV – AM/F,RC)
FORWARDS
21. Lens (PSV – F,RLC)
22. Huntelaar (Schalke – S,C)
23. Boerrigter (Ajax – F,L)

2nd XI

———————–12.Krul——————-

———––15.Maduro-16.Mathijsen———–
14.Boulahrouz——————17.Emanuelson

——————18.N.De Jong—————-
——–-20.Wijnaldum—-19.V.d.Vaart——–

21.Lens-22.Huntelaar—23.Boerrigter

Holland EURO 2012 Full Squad (23)

GOAL
1. Stekelenburg (Roma – GK)
12. Krul (Newcastle – GK)
13. Vorm (Swansea – GK)
DEFENCE
2. V.d.Wiel (Ajax – D,RC)
3. Pieters (PSV – D,L)
4. Heitinga (Everton – D/DM,C)
5. Douglas (Twente – D,C)
14. Boulahrouz (Stuttgart – D,RC)
15. Maduro (Valencia – D/DM,C)
16. Mathijsen (Malaga – D,C)
17. Emanuelson (Milan – D/M,L)
MIDFIELD
6. V.Bommel (Milan – DM,C)
8. Afellay (Barcelona – M/AM,RLC)
10. Sneijder (Inter – AM,C)
18. N.De Jong (Man City – DM,C)
19. V.d.Vaart (Tottenham – M/AM,C)
20. Wijnaldum (PSV – AM/F,RC)
FORWARDS
7. Elia (Juventus – F,RL)
9. V.Persie (Arsenal – F,RLC)
11. Robben (Bayern – F,RL)
21. Lens (PSV – F,RLC)
22. Huntelaar (Schalke – S,C)
23. Boerrigter (Ajax – F,RL)

By Bill | November 19th, 2011 at 8:30 pm

“And now we did the same thing. We allowed Germany to think they were better.
And in less than a year ( with our big guns back and most likely another back four ) we will show them what Total Football is about.”

Ahhh please, this Dutch team doesn’t deserve to spit shine the class of 1998 or 2000s shoes let alone talk about showing anyone total football. They scored 2 opportunistic goals against Brazil in the QF, were matched by Uruguay and outplayed comprehensively by Spain (to anyone who actually WATCHED the game and didn’t read ‘1-0′ the morning after and assume it was close). You blamed Webb a few times I see. Robben was in on goal, stumbled, then had the nerve to go up to the referree and say “I could have dived but i didn’t! give me credit and red card puyol” ? Really? And for most of the match, the dutch vinnie jones, van Bommel and his kung fu sidekick De Jong are hacking down the Spanish? This is what you call close to winning a world cup?
Anyway, bottom line, Holland hasn’t played total football since 2004 so what you think they’re all of a sudden gonna turn it on in 6 months over a couple of friendlies?
Like JC said, its a mediocre team with a few world class players sprinkled over the top (who always take turns at being injured). So basically, Holland has turned into the Germany of the 90s, a few world class players surrounded by mediocre ones who rely on tactics rather than technique to get results.
Good luck deluding yourselves into thinking you have a chance next Euro.

By bill's enemy | November 19th, 2011 at 11:58 pm

bill you must support the canadian or american national team.. this would explain your stupidity

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