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We’re proud of our roots!

June 25th, 2007 | By: Jan | 17 Comments »

Since the issue was raised here and the AD newspaper wrote an article about it, I decided to give it some attention after all… This is the text:

The champions of Oranje Saturday consisted of six players with a Suriname background. During the after-party, there where orange and red-white-blue flags but also a couple of players were seen carrying the Suriname flag.

We don’t have to try to seek too much behind that. The young internationals are proud of their roots, but they also regard themselves to be “normal” Dutch people.

As if they haven’t seen enough of eachother. Next Tuesday Babel, Drenthe, Waterman, Donk and Zuiverloon will fly to Suriname, to have a well-deserved holiday in the land of their ancestors.

Foppe de Haan wasn’t happy with the flag-waving afther the finals. “No, I don’t think that was necessary. We achieved this with the Dutch team. If they want to wave the Suriname flag, they should do it some other day. Bakkal isn’t waving the Morrocon flag is he? And Daniel de Ridder isn’t waving the Israelian flag. And if we would have players with an English or French background, we wouldn’t want them to wave their flags…”

Royston Drenthe understood the words of his coach. “Yes, I see what he means, but he doesn’t need to worry about our loyalty and love for Holland. We are born here and work hard for our country. Most people will have seen it in the last two weeks. I am a Dutchman in my heart. All the way, but my roots are in Suriname. That’s all.

Apart from the mentioned players, Maduro is partly Antillian (Maceo Rigters is from Suriname as well). Only Kruiswijk and Pieters are full-blood Dutchies.

Foppe de Haan did well to glue the multi-cultural team together. “Team spirit won us the cup this year,” the injured captain Ron Vlaar said after the awards-ceremony. “We had a tight team last year as well, but since we lost some quality last year we knew the team-spirit was even more important this time around. We also wanted a click with the fans, who really became our 12th man. Players like Royston can really get that together.”

The vibe in the group is regarded by all as the key to success. And that used to be different in the past. In the mid-90s, the so-called “Cable” introduced itself to Dutch football. With that term a group of players with Suriname ancestry – among them Davids, Seedorf, Kluivert, Reiziger and Bogarde – was meant, and they sought to re-establish their identity. But the word Cable got quite a negative connotation in the Dutch media.

But with the Under 21s the heritage is not an issue, so it seems. Kruiswijk and Zuiverloon embracing each other and doing their tribal dance. De Haan and Drenthe could be father & son, if you look how they act together.

Julian Jenner, white, wanted to go to Suriname with the other players. “I will go somewhere else with my girlfriend, because we booked that already. But I don’t mind them waving their flag. Why shouldn’t they? They are Dutch people from Suriname and they’re proud. There are no little groups in the group, everyone can get along with everyone.”

And goalie Boy Waterman: “My cousin called on the day of the finals, saying he would come to the stadium with a Suriname flag. I kinda liked that idea. It is the country of my forefathers. But, people shouldn’t try to find things that aren’t there. We’re all Dutch now.”

Tags: Foppe de Haan, Royston Drenthe, The Netherlands

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Comments

By Luis | June 25th, 2007 at 9:25 am

The world is no longer one dimensional. People, cultures and ethnic heritage mix freely and spill over borders. I myself am an American citizen, but extremely proud of my Portuguese heritage. My family is scattered throughout 4 or 5 nations, but we will always be Portuguese.

The Dutch should be proud that their society is viewed as an open, multi-cultural society where people of all backgrounds can be part of the Dutch modern nation.

In Portugal, these things are part of the normal fabric of a dynamic and modern civic arena. Perhaps because Portugal has always turned toward it’s immigrant communities and former colonies it seems like no big deal to us.

NL should be proud that the rest of the world looks at your nation as a place of freedom and open expression where people of all backgrounds can find opportunities and a truly inclusive society.

Posted from United States

By goose | June 25th, 2007 at 9:45 am

thats besides the point Luis, there are times and places to show your pride…and thats not on a pitch were you just won the EC Championships representing HOLLAND..im sorry, if you love the country of your parents or grandparents (again; all these guys are born in Holland and most of their parents are too) so much then play for that country and not mine

it has nothing to do with a multi-cultural society (which can not excist) youre either dutch or you are not..if you respresent your country theres nothing in between!!

still think it was very disrespectful to us dutch..i have never seen these guys as anything other than dutch…no i see them as Surinams who play for Holland cause it can bring them so much more then if they would play in Surinam..
again: should deRidder wave the Israel flag, Bakal the Turkish flag, should Deco wave the brasilian flag etc.etc., ?? ofcourse not…dont think Gullit and Rijkaard for one moment felt like waving the surinam flag in 88?? dont think so

im still proud of the dutch society but its a dutch society and nothing else

proud of your roots is fine, most of us are…but theres a time and place to celebrate that and this was not the time

im glad at least Fobbe deHaan agrees with me!!

grtz

Posted from Netherlands

By Luis | June 25th, 2007 at 10:34 am

Goose - I hear your points, I just don’t quite understand why it’s such a big deal. A celebration of any kind is a form of self expression. They helped you to win the trophy. I think they have earned the right to celebrate any way they want. If you see that as an insult, then that is your choice, but I’m certain they meant no harm.

Enjoy the moment. The world is changing around us and we can either be a part of the change or a victim of it.

In my humble opinion, as a neutral, I think Dutch society should be proud of the fact that these athletes came from such humble beginnings to reach the pinnacle of their chosen professions in NL. They did it for NL, but they also did it for their families. For their elders who may have struggled for many years to give them a chance to thrive and achieve great things.

If you reflect for a moment, I hope you will agree that perhaps that was their way of saying thank you.

Posted from United States

By goose | June 25th, 2007 at 11:34 am

its such a big deal cause theres a lot of stress in Holland when it comes to integration of immigrants (i will stop the politics now, haha)

btw: hummble beginning??? same as all others i think

my point is the same as Fobbe’s: theres a time and a place to think of your roots and this was not the time

for me personal its very dissapointing to see these guys still dont feel dutch even do theyre all botn here and only been to Surinam on holiday, none of them speak surinam..i never saw them as surinams, now i do..that saddens me and a lot of people in Holland (even questions in parlement! not kidding)

dont think it has anything to do with ‘the changing world’, you still play for a national team (ea for a country) the fans that support them are fans of that particular country..im not a fan of surinam!

really luis, what if you guys would win and Deco would wave the Brasil flag!! how would you feel?? now imagine half the team waving an other countrys flag??

well, feel a bit sorry for the guys cause this is all people talk about in Holland…

ill stop about it, youre right, the insult is in the eye of the beholder.. (but still feel insulted, hahaha)

grzt

Posted from Netherlands

By Luis | June 25th, 2007 at 12:07 pm

“its such a big deal cause theres a lot of stress in Holland when it comes to integration of immigrants”

The best way to deal with this stress is to celebrate diversity. I’m an immigrant myself and I know full well the challenges of integration, but it’s nothing new. Time cures all things.

“btw: hummble beginning??? same as all others i think”

Whether 1 or 5 generations. There was a time when achieving what they achieved was unthinkable and it spoke directly to the people of Surinam via satellite. Perhaps today, the NL and Suriname are close today because of it.

“what if you guys would win and Deco would wave the Brazil flag!! how would you feel??”

I would have no problem with it at all. Brazil and Portugal and sister nations and have given each other many things over time. The usual talking heads in Portugal would have a field day with the headlines though. I’m not 100% certain, but I think Scolari himself has had a few Brazilian flags draped on him along with the Portuguese flag.

As for Deco, well like I said, I would take no offense, but Deco is too smart for that. And what do you mean ‘if’? You mean ‘when’!

Agreed, enough politics.

Posted from United States

By lars | June 25th, 2007 at 12:36 pm

i agree with goose. if the english players like ashley cole and ledley king started waving barbados and antigan flags around after winning a big tournement for england, (which is where there parents lived) i wouldnt be too happy. If it was me and i was a proffesional footballer i would have the choice to play for holland or england whichever one i would chose would be the one i would stick to i wouldnt wave about a dutch flag if i was playin for england!!!

Posted from United Kingdom

By goose | June 25th, 2007 at 1:28 pm

lol Luis… it prob. should be when..

grtz

Posted from Netherlands

By Mario | June 25th, 2007 at 4:37 pm

I think it is something they did with no harm and we have to take it easy about it but yeah, perhaps that was not the stage to do it because although they have every right to feel proud of their roots they should think a little bit more of the country that has offered better lifes so perhaps they should have kept their pride for themselves and not so openly but I don´t think it is such a big deal.

Posted from Mexico

By stephen | June 25th, 2007 at 6:08 pm

tacky…bad manners…immaturity…a bit unsavory…disrespectful, I mean, these are U-21s remember. But I’m sure the dutch are glad they are on their side Still they could use a lesson in manners 101. Celebrate the team and nation you just won with, not the country your ancestors are from. If everybody did that, it would be pretty weird indeed.

Posted from United States

By Jan | June 25th, 2007 at 6:17 pm

So who’s right and who’s wrong… no one I guess. Or we all are… Interesting viewpoints, thanks Goose for clarifying your position I can definitely see your point now. The fact that government is being harrassed about it by our congress is typical Dutch :-).

Still, the fact that “other” nationalities do not do this (Maduro, Bakkal, etc) says something about the ol’ feeling of inferiority by the the Surname people vs the Dutch. We were the oppressors at one stage I guess and the Suriname people copped a lot of racism and discrimination in the past. I remember how that remark by Libregts really had a huge impact on the Suriname people (when talking about Ruud Gullit, the Dutch team manager stated: you know how these darkies are, very athletic but also lazy…).

So, there’s obviously a sore muscle in there somewhere and that fact in itself is interesting but hard to heal now…

Anyway, there’s two things I hate: racism and black people…

(THIS IS A JOKE GUYS, I DIDN’T MAKE IT UP, IT’S BY ONE OF OUR COMEDIANS…DON’T SHOOT ME…)

Posted from Australia

By goose | June 26th, 2007 at 7:18 am

Latest: the KNVB is actually banning flags from other countries on the pitch when Oranje plays… Kessler sounds very pissed off, looks like im not alone, all dutch people are pissed..

so: 1. no matches against Marocco
2. no flags form other countries

grtz

Posted from Netherlands

By Jan | June 26th, 2007 at 7:22 am

Wow… you actually raised a very valid point again, Goose… See, that’s what most of us on this blog dearly miss….a connection to the country, to what the people feel.. Thanks for bringing this up!

Posted from Australia

By goose | June 26th, 2007 at 7:39 am

you guys are soooo lucky that im such a typical dutch guy..hahahaha..

grzt

Posted from Netherlands

By Raul | June 29th, 2007 at 3:54 am

just read this discussion and probably you are not following the thread anymore, but anyway:

may I point out that the ancestors of the players with surinam background did NOT came to surinam (back then Holland) as immigrants but as slaves!

Thats why these players have all the right to take special pride of their heritage and achievements. The other dutch people should be very humble about such expressions as flag waving…

Posted from Netherlands

By Pedro P | June 29th, 2007 at 4:34 am

Goose, only read a few lines, on the top comments. I am sorry pal, you are as blind as you look…

You understand absolutelly nothing of what it is a multi-cultural society. You are afraid. Why? What’s frightening you…?

You can be embodied with the spirit of PT, e.g, and recognize your roots from Brazil to Timor… It covers half the world… can you just imagine how much bigger than anyone this is…? You’d still be portuguese somehow and all the rest too…

I guess if dutch had, like portuguese (who were of course no angels at all, but suffered the most), mixed, married, blended, transported, travelled, searched for, made part of, everything that’s different, becamed acitivelly part of and renegating, or allowing oneself to dissolve in something else and still be oneself, for some 500 years, you might understand why the dutch society looks at itself as tolerant, but then has 1000 rules for than and castrates everything that deviates 1 milimiter away from it.

Sorry dude, be a bit less arrogant and realize you just don’t own the truth. Cos nobody really does…

NL is so tolerant that the minister proposes that only dutch can be spoken in the streets of R’dam. That foreign flags should be banned from stadia. Etc…

Oh, BTW Goose, bring on the flags of Brazil, of Angola, of Mozambique, of East Timor, Guine, Macau, Goa, whatever, and all the others that don’t belong to these more than 200 million that still speak portuguese but still have something like “Silva”, “Fernandes”, “Coelho”, “Pires”, Vieira”, etc, in their surname…

Contrary to you, this would make me feel even more portuguese… But I guess it’s just not in the dutch genes to understant this…

Man, you should be proud of those Surinamese flags! They are a part of you or what you like to call the “dutch tolerant society”. The only ones that love mirrors are narcyiss…