Comments on: JC: It was a pretty good result http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html World Cup 2010 - South Africa, Oranje, Nederlands Elftal, Eredivisie, Marco van Basten, Dutch football, The Netherlands Tue, 24 Nov 2009 08:05:34 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: goose http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78727 goose Mon, 25 Jun 2007 19:02:38 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78727 sorry forgot..very nice tube on the team..really nice one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZdWbu6RqI4 sorry forgot..very nice tube on the team..really nice one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZdWbu6RqI4

]]> By: goose http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78726 goose Mon, 25 Jun 2007 19:00:45 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78726 btw: heres a tube on saturdays final http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qndBdQ3hbeI grtz btw: heres a tube on saturdays final

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qndBdQ3hbeI

grtz

]]> By: Rami http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78641 Rami Mon, 25 Jun 2007 09:05:08 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78641 I know Jan. I know your not the "i dont care how we win as long as we win" type of thinking.. but also im very skeptikal, and concerned about " i agree to change to a 442 formation if VB can get to make the national team start playing good" kind of thing.. that easy way is really something id go for as a very last resort, and even then, unwillingly. im sorry to bring this subject again and again, but thats been solely on my mind after we won on saturday, and after the recent JC/De Haan issue. Much more important and interesting than whether drenthe and rigters should be condemned or not. I know Jan. I know your not the “i dont care how we win as long as we win” type of thinking.. but also im very skeptikal, and concerned about ” i agree to change to a 442 formation if VB can get to make the national team start playing good” kind of thing..

that easy way is really something id go for as a very last resort, and even then, unwillingly.

im sorry to bring this subject again and again, but thats been solely on my mind after we won on saturday, and after the recent JC/De Haan issue. Much more important and interesting than whether drenthe and rigters should be condemned or not.

]]> By: Jan http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78638 Jan Mon, 25 Jun 2007 08:44:38 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78638 Rami, I think you misunderstood me. I did say it a bit blunt, but it's a topic that's been around for a long time on this blog and i've wrote different comments on it. I won't go into it here. I'll go into it in a specific post. But I can assure you I am NOT from the i-don't-care-how-we-win-as-long-as-we win-school of thought. You should know that :-). Rami, I think you misunderstood me. I did say it a bit blunt, but it’s a topic that’s been around for a long time on this blog and i’ve wrote different comments on it. I won’t go into it here. I’ll go into it in a specific post. But I can assure you I am NOT from the i-don’t-care-how-we-win-as-long-as-we win-school of thought. You should know that :-) .

]]> By: Rami http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78633 Rami Mon, 25 Jun 2007 07:38:08 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78633 its not only his pride, but the pride of a whole generation of dutch football u are talking about. its not only his pride, but the pride of a whole generation of dutch football u are talking about.

]]> By: Miguel Rosado http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78630 Miguel Rosado Mon, 25 Jun 2007 07:28:16 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78630 I think experimenting would be good for Marco, you need to change formations from time to time because if you don't do this the other teams will know what to do and how to mark your players. Foppe used the 4-3-3 system but when he found out that it wasn't working as well as before he tried the 4-4-2 and clicked, Marco needs to leave aside his pride and start experimenting new things. I think experimenting would be good for Marco, you need to change formations from time to time because if you don’t do this the other teams will know what to do and how to mark your players.

Foppe used the 4-3-3 system but when he found out that it wasn’t working as well as before he tried the 4-4-2 and clicked, Marco needs to leave aside his pride and start experimenting new things.

]]> By: Rami http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78628 Rami Mon, 25 Jun 2007 07:15:20 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78628 the answer is again, the dutch league. it has to rise up again, and challenge the others, keep the players interested in staying because they would be playing football at the highest level. its the only hope for total football to survive really, and for our players to know how to execute it efficiently, unless, ur an idiot like vb and think u can pull it off by simply calling the players for international duty every now and then and hope theyll know what the hell they'll be doing on the pitch. the answer is again, the dutch league. it has to rise up again, and challenge the others, keep the players interested in staying because they would be playing football at the highest level. its the only hope for total football to survive really, and for our players to know how to execute it efficiently, unless, ur an idiot like vb and think u can pull it off by simply calling the players for international duty every now and then and hope theyll know what the hell they’ll be doing on the pitch.

]]> By: Rami http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78627 Rami Mon, 25 Jun 2007 07:05:54 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78627 well , thats still beside the point.. Its not simply a question of formation Jan.. thats too simplistic.. its completely two different ways of football. its total football theory vs conservative conventional football. Weve seen and are seeing both in practise, both work, theyre not only theories.. and when executed they are totally different, and u know that! As dutch, half dutch, dutch supporters and fans, one of the main things that we identify with in dutch football is our dutch way of playing football. Simply put.. which is none other than rinus' way of looking at football, namely total football.. now do we want to keep that or not? thats the debate im talking about. the way u are argumenting Jan is something along the lines of 'as long as the team brings me the trophy i wouldnt mind or care of the cost or damage'. Yes i find it would be much easier to play 442 or anything similar to that. And it might as well bring us the trophy much easier than total football at this point, because most of todays dutch talent and dutch world class footballers adapt their way of playing to the conventional system. And in fact, they are only world class and talented players in that system. if u take VN or seedorf or VB or robben and put them in Ajax in the 70s theyll all fail completely. And as far as the debate being swift because mr van basten says he wants to stick to total football, thats all crap, because it is much more complicated than simply fitting (more like forcing) todays dutch players into a complex system like the one he advocates. And you need nothing other really than look at the results. what have they been?? failure in germany, and horrible football all along.. In other words, todays dutch talent and stars are no way near pulling off total football way of playing. Not that theyre not good enough, theyre great players, but in a completely different way of playing! well , thats still beside the point.. Its not simply a question of formation Jan.. thats too simplistic.. its completely two different ways of football. its total football theory vs conservative conventional football. Weve seen and are seeing both in practise, both work, theyre not only theories.. and when executed they are totally different, and u know that!

As dutch, half dutch, dutch supporters and fans, one of the main things that we identify with in dutch football is our dutch way of playing football. Simply put.. which is none other than rinus’ way of looking at football, namely total football..

now do we want to keep that or not? thats the debate im talking about. the way u are argumenting Jan is something along the lines of ‘as long as the team brings me the trophy i wouldnt mind or care of the cost or damage’. Yes i find it would be much easier to play 442 or anything similar to that. And it might as well bring us the trophy much easier than total football at this point, because most of todays dutch talent and dutch world class footballers adapt their way of playing to the conventional system. And in fact, they are only world class and talented players in that system. if u take VN or seedorf or VB or robben and put them in Ajax in the 70s theyll all fail completely.

And as far as the debate being swift because mr van basten says he wants to stick to total football, thats all crap, because it is much more complicated than simply fitting (more like forcing) todays dutch players into a complex system like the one he advocates. And you need nothing other really than look at the results. what have they been?? failure in germany, and horrible football all along..

In other words, todays dutch talent and stars are no way near pulling off total football way of playing. Not that theyre not good enough, theyre great players, but in a completely different way of playing!

]]> By: Mario http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78615 Mario Mon, 25 Jun 2007 04:30:40 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78615 Man, many Mexicans cheer for the Dutch, including myself!!!. Well, I think that debate is useless, team formations are important but what matters the most is fielding your best players around, something de Haan has done and van Basten has not done so far. So, I think that the future of Dutch soccer is brilliant but some changes will have to happen if we wanna be succesful at Euro 08. Perhaps the system, introducing some new players, fielding the experienced guys to have a good mix of youth and experiencie in the team and then the team will rock again, and perhaps one change is the head coach...I doubt that it will happen before Euro 08 but I hope it happens because I don´t think van Basten has the skills right now to guide us to the very top, perhaps in some years he will be a top coach but why wasting our chances when we have a very talented squad in having an unexperienced coach with big ego and bad motivation skills. I think that the pressure for van Basten will increase after the Bulgaria game if the team doesn´t get better because Foppe de Haan has shown the world that Holland is very much capable of lifting trophies and playing nice soccer with any system and if van Basten keeps winning luckily like vs Slovenia then why not look at de Haan???. He still is capable of working at the top level, he is a leader, he has plenty of experiencie, has worked with many of the Dutch young guns and I am sure he will love to finish his career guiding the Netherlands in a big tournamente like an European Championship or a World Cup. Well, only time will tell. Man, many Mexicans cheer for the Dutch, including myself!!!.
Well, I think that debate is useless, team formations are important but what matters the most is fielding your best players around, something de Haan has done and van Basten has not done so far. So, I think that the future of Dutch soccer is brilliant but some changes will have to happen if we wanna be succesful at Euro 08. Perhaps the system, introducing some new players, fielding the experienced guys to have a good mix of youth and experiencie in the team and then the team will rock again, and perhaps one change is the head coach…I doubt that it will happen before Euro 08 but I hope it happens because I don´t think van Basten has the skills right now to guide us to the very top, perhaps in some years he will be a top coach but why wasting our chances when we have a very talented squad in having an unexperienced coach with big ego and bad motivation skills. I think that the pressure for van Basten will increase after the Bulgaria game if the team doesn´t get better because Foppe de Haan has shown the world that Holland is very much capable of lifting trophies and playing nice soccer with any system and if van Basten keeps winning luckily like vs Slovenia then why not look at de Haan???. He still is capable of working at the top level, he is a leader, he has plenty of experiencie, has worked with many of the Dutch young guns and I am sure he will love to finish his career guiding the Netherlands in a big tournamente like an European Championship or a World Cup. Well, only time will tell.

]]> By: Jan http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html/comment-page-1#comment-78614 Jan Mon, 25 Jun 2007 04:27:52 +0000 http://netherlands.worldcupblog.org/1/jc-it-was-a-pretty-good-result.html#comment-78614 Well, as long as Marco is manager the discussion will be short. He will never step away from 4-3-3 even if it's only coz he doesn't want to lose face. And to me it's bugger all. I mean, you can play with a forward no. 10 (Bergkamp role) next to Ruud and two wide midfielders and tell everyone you're playing 4-3-3... I really think the whole debate is intellectual masturbation anyway. I'm more worried about the big step the Maduro's and Rigters' of this world need to make to move on. The difference between the U21 team and the bog guns is mentality. There are many skilled players (Quincy, anyone??) who can't make the step up due to that particular item. Fighting spirit. Living for your sport. Going the distance every day for 10 years in a row. I can see Donk and Babel and Drenthe making it big amongst the big boys. De Ridder, Bakkal, Zuiverloon, Vlaar, Rigters...they're all question marks to me, to be honest... Well, as long as Marco is manager the discussion will be short. He will never step away from 4-3-3 even if it’s only coz he doesn’t want to lose face. And to me it’s bugger all. I mean, you can play with a forward no. 10 (Bergkamp role) next to Ruud and two wide midfielders and tell everyone you’re playing 4-3-3… I really think the whole debate is intellectual masturbation anyway.

I’m more worried about the big step the Maduro’s and Rigters’ of this world need to make to move on. The difference between the U21 team and the bog guns is mentality. There are many skilled players (Quincy, anyone??) who can’t make the step up due to that particular item. Fighting spirit. Living for your sport. Going the distance every day for 10 years in a row. I can see Donk and Babel and Drenthe making it big amongst the big boys. De Ridder, Bakkal, Zuiverloon, Vlaar, Rigters…they’re all question marks to me, to be honest…

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