Comments on: Foppe: we didn’t have a Messi

By: Caleb

Caleb — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 20:33:35 +0000

It’s odd, I just finished watching the game, and during the anthems I was thinking the same thing as many of you have brought up, and then I come here to the blog and see this discussion about it. Great minds think alike??

I really liked the way goose put it:
“i dont care if players are ‘native’ dutch or not, dont care what their religion is etc. BUT i only want players playing for Holland who feel dutch, are proud of Holland and are willing to give it all for Holland…not guys who feel Surinam or turkish and play for Holland only cause it gives them the best international platform for their OWN careers”

Lately I’ve been becoming more aware about increasing cultural crises, especially in Europe, when immigrants come to a new country but make absolutely no effort to integrate/learn the culture/learn the language. I think this discussion about singing the anthem is related to that topic.

By: --HedonistiX

--HedonistiX — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 16:19:41 +0000

There seems to be a positive correlation between “singing national anthem” and “playing hard for the country”. Most obvious example: Kuyt for us, Gattuso in the Italian team and 99% of German players.

I also believe if one is deemed worthy enough to represent their country (esp. a powerhouse like the Oranje), they should be very proud and sing the national anthem with enthusiasm. This is not a matter of being jingoistic but showing the respect to the people they are representing and their supporters. Shouldn’t matter whether they are “natives” or “non-natives”. Head coaches should probably start instilling this.

Also wrote on this forum during the EC about how Netherlands’ high living standards might have contributed to the lack of fighting spirits.

By: Michel-Olivier

Michel-Olivier — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 14:49:38 +0000

they should change “am i of german blood” to “am i of dutch/frisian/orange/germanic blood”

By: goose

goose — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:16:24 +0000

Best singers during WC/EC; vNistelrooy, Kuyt, vdSar and vBasten
i remember Engelaar NOT singing

singing the anthem was almost not-done during the 70s, 80s (youll never see a player sing in the WC74 for instance) during the late 90s* this view changed… singing the anthem has had a big revival here in Holland and NOT singing is now seen as a kind of insult

* with the arrival of multi-culturalism wich saw a new interest in the dutch identity (is still going on today)

By: s

Wed, 20 Aug 2008 08:18:33 +0000

Marco Van Basten sang it too during the EC

By: finnster01

finnster01 — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:21:35 +0000

I should add Kuyt too. He seemed to sing loud too at the EC. (Although he may have thought his daugther a few songs she could have been better off not knowing

By: finnster01

finnster01 — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:19:52 +0000

@Goose;

that was a very informative piece. Nice and proud lyrics, just like a proper national anthem should have.

Who is the best singers in the Dutch team? I am a big believer in players weraing their national shirt should show respect and dignity for their country and belt out the anthem.

Anyone notice anyone not singing? RVN always seemed to do it with some effort, EVDS also. But a lot of the others never seemed to care too much. I don’t think that is very respectful.

By: Prabal Rakshit

Prabal Rakshit — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 01:45:34 +0000

Nice one, Goose. Thanks for the lucid explanation.

By: goose

goose — Tue, 19 Aug 2008 20:28:53 +0000

@Prabal; no, not really; i guess we dutch always knew we were semi-germans
our whole monarchie is german, queen Beatrix married a german, here mother married a german…. the only problem we had was when Beatrix married Claus ( a german) that was not so long after the war and it was a bit tense (raus mit Claus)
Willem van Oranje was a german (with properties in France) but is seen as ‘vader des vaderlands’( father of the fatherland), the first real dutchie

the lyrics in our anthem are great; ill try and translate some of it;
dutch:

Wilhelmus van Nassouwe
ben ik, van Duitsen bloed,
den vaderland getrouwe
blijf ik tot in den dood.
Een Prinse van Oranje
ben ik, vrij onverveerd,
den Koning van Hispanje
heb ik altijd geëerd.

translation;

Wilhelmus van Nassouwe
am i of german blood *
ill be faithful to my fatherland
until i die
a prince of Orange
i am free and without fear
the king of Spain *1
i have always honoured

*(in old dutch thats ‘dietsen bloed’and doest stand for germans only but was a wider range of people living in that part of Europe

*1 Holland was ofcourse part of the spanish kingdom till ‘de Opstand’(the Revolt) in the 16th C)

but all in all i can say that germans are not hated in Holland like in older days…most of us think they are polite and decent (but without a sense of humor)

nice one to say to a german friend:
ask him; “Sorry my friend but you lost something”
the german answers; ” ah thanks, what did i lose??”
you answer: the second world war!!

hahahaha

By: finnster01

finnster01 — Tue, 19 Aug 2008 18:16:34 +0000

@Prabal, you may want to check with Goose, but I believe there was a bit of a bicycle issue at the time. As I don’t speak any Dutch, not sure if the natinal anthem adress the issue, but given what I know and have experienced of the country, I would not be surprised if it did.